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Thread: Government shutdown continues, no agreement in sight

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by TopDogger View Post
    I think the Democrats have effectively broken the work ethic for too many people in the USA.
    Not that I want to defend the Democrats, but I believe that the multi national corporations broke the work ethic by sending millions jobs overseas to maximize their profits. They should be taxed like hell on their importations.

    What do emerging countries? They tax heavily our exportation, we are stupid to let them get away with this, because at the end we are screwed.

    The consumers and clients will have the last word on the market anyway, but it will be too late, destruction of many national corporations and labor will be gone.

    As far as the multi party system, you could have a system like this:

    Left wing - Center left wing - Center right wing - Right wing
    Last edited by Franc Tireur; 12 October, 2013 at 22:50 PM.
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.

    Voltaire


  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Franc Tireur View Post
    Not that I want to defend the Democrats, but I believe that the multi national corporations broke the work ethic by sending millions jobs overseas to maximize their profits. They should be taxed like hell on their importations.

    What do emerging countries? They tax heavily our exportation, we are stupid to let them get away with this, because at the end we are screwed.

    The consumers and clients will have the last word on the market anyway, but it will be too late, destruction of many national corporations and labor will be gone.

    As far as the multi party system, you could have a system like this:

    Left wing - Center left wing - Center right wing - Right wing
    I'm talking about the huge growth people more willing to sit home and collect benefits than find a job to earn a living. It has become too easy to sit home and live off of the taxpayers.

    Both parties started out representing people in the middle with slightly different viewpoints. Today they mostly represent people with radical viewpoints.

    There has always been opposing parties, but the takeover of the Democrat party by radical in the 1960s has ratcheted both parties further apart over the years. A radicalization of one party has created an equal and opposite reaction with the other party. For example, there would never have been a need for the Tea Party if not for the lavish overspending on the part of the Democrats.
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin


  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by TopDogger View Post
    I'm talking about the huge growth people more willing to sit home and collect benefits than find a job to earn a living. It has become too easy to sit home and live off of the taxpayers.
    I believe that many powerful actors in the system changed the whole game because of greed, geopolitics and special interests. So it is difficult to think the same way than before, rules of the system were changed.

    Both parties started out representing people in the middle with slightly different viewpoints. Today they mostly represent people with radical viewpoints.

    There has always been opposing parties, but the takeover of the Democrat party by radical in the 1960s has ratcheted both parties further apart over the years. A radicalization of one party has created an equal and opposite reaction with the other party. For example, there would never have been a need for the Tea Party if not for the lavish overspending on the part of the Democrats.
    I agree entirely with you on this, there is obviously a radicalization in the political class, and that's not only in US, you can see it in the western countries too. The problem with that is the strength of moderate politicians weaken and it will be harder to have compromises, like we are witnessing today. There is also an important factor to take into consideration, the moderates from left and right, merged.

    Today right and left doesn't mean anything, particularely in Europe, because they've got the same ideology goal. The problem is that the people are suffering and it is not going to get better.

    Here I saw some left and right politicians having the same goal, I don't know how far it is, but I guess it is pretty advanced.

    Anyway, if you follow the whole thing in both contiments, and their goal of merging under the trans Alantic treaty, it is only the beginning of something huge and unstoppable.

    I just hope, it would be for the best interest of the people.
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.

    Voltaire


  4. #24
    For example, there would never have been a need for the Tea Party if not for the lavish overspending on the part of the Democrats.
    The tea party was a response to lavish overspending period. Not limited to dems. Both sides have a hand in it.
    -- Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and good with ketchup. --

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by robjones View Post
    The tea party was a response to lavish overspending period. Not limited to dems. Both sides have a hand in it.
    Yep, I agree. But I don't think the blame can be spread equally across parties. It went completely out of control when Pelosi took over Congress and pledged to have a pay-as-you-go Congress.

    In the history of the country we never saw gross overspending like we experienced like this time around when the Dems regained full control of the Congress and Senate. We can blame Bush for getting us involved in two wars and not using his veto powers, as well as several Republicans who jumped on the spending bandwagon, but the most wasteful spending originated with the Dems.

    Any loyal American should deeply resent the way the Obomber treats taxpayer money like it is his own private piggy bank. He spends record amounts on excessive numbers of vacations, handouts to the Muslim Brotherhood and countries that are never going to be our friends.

    The Tea Party started in 2009 in response to 2 years of Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid spending politics, which any sensible person knew was going to get much worse with Obomber in the White House.

    It has been a real looooooooong time since we have had a real leader in the White House.
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin


  6. #26
    When I am reading this, it is so extreme, I think they are out of the line:

    Hastings was among the first to suggest Obama was picking and choosing his targets. He pointed out that while high-profile sites like the Lincoln Memorial were closed, low-key monuments scattered throughout the District were open. "It appears as though only the highly visible monuments and areas are being closed to the public -- further proof that the Obama administration is only playing politics and purposely choosing to make this shutdown as painful as possible," he said soon after the partial shutdown began.

    And a National Park Service ranger told The Washington Times: "We've been told to make life as difficult for people as we can. It's disgusting."

    The administration, in rolling back some of its cuts, argues it was compelled to act with a heavy hand at the beginning of the budget impasse.
    Rollback of cuts fuels claims that government inflated impact of partial shutdown | Fox News
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.

    Voltaire


  7. #27
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin


  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by TopDogger View Post
    There are too much special interests in jeopardy and the cake is too good to share it, the people may get the crumbs.
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.

    Voltaire


  9. #29
    So Much For Negotiating: White House Rejects House Republican Proposal

    Before Boehner and his merry men even had a chance to explain themselves, the White House has pre-empted...

    • WHITE HOUSE SAYS LATEST FISCAL PROPOSAL FROM HOUSE REPUBLICANS IS "PARTISAN ATTEMPT TO APPEASE A SMALL GROUP OF TEA PARTY REPUBLICANS
    • WHITE HOUSE SAYS DEMOCRATS, REPUBLICANS IN SENATE HAVE BEEN WORKING IN GOOD FAITH ON FISCAL IMPASSE, AND TIME FOR HOUSE TO DO SAME
    • WHITE HOUSE REJECTS HOUSE GOP PROPOSAL TO RAISE DEBT LIMIT AND REOPEN GOVERNMENT

    Between Boehner's "Senate bill is hand grenade" and Van Hollen's "House Bill is reckless" comments, how anyone can argue we are getting closer to deal is beyond us... Obama is at least consistent - "unconditional surrender of default" remains the only play for now...
    So Much For Negotiating: White House Rejects House Republican Proposal | Zero Hedge

    "unconditional surrender of default" that a radical policy.

    What negociations? There are only rejected proposals. The negotiations never took place!
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.

    Voltaire


  10. #30
    If it's any consolation, there appears to be yet another measure coming from the House to the Senate for a vote. No idea if it will comply with all the demands Harry Reid and Obama have insisted on, which may or may not include Boehner doing Reid's dirty laundry for a month and Cruz going on a date with Obama.

    All I know is if the latest measure is turned down by the guys who keep claiming to have been bending over backwards while refusing to negotiate, the media will declare it the fault of racist terrorist jihadist tea-party anarchist assholes. Because that's what the media does. McCain will as always vote with the DNC while proclaiming himself all mavericky, and he'll blame Cruz for a weak economy, global warming and the Kennedy assassination. Obama will pat him on the head and toss him a Scooby snack.

    Reid, Pelosi, Obama et al complained that Bush was a maniac for his spending. The debt was in single digits then. It's approaching $17 trillion now and Harry wants another trillion. DC is broke in more ways than one. Hope everyone's stocking up on bread, water and ammo. We're on a collision course with a breakdown.
    -- Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and good with ketchup. --

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